tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3166297507174717122.post5567208305662021993..comments2024-03-27T21:42:56.131-05:00Comments on 1001plus: Millennials: The MusicalSJHoneywellhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/13550007053995112090noreply@blogger.comBlogger24125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3166297507174717122.post-85551272625219113532017-07-05T14:41:57.566-05:002017-07-05T14:41:57.566-05:00We'll disagree on that. I realize that nationw...We'll disagree on that. I realize that nationwide I'm in the minority on this, but so far on this blog, people have tended to agree with my disappointment.SJHoneywellhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13550007053995112090noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3166297507174717122.post-28074522424239887712017-07-05T14:27:52.590-05:002017-07-05T14:27:52.590-05:00I saw it with my niece, who had been making a big ...I saw it with my niece, who had been making a big deal about La La Land for several weeks. Knowing her tastes I assumed it was anime. <br /><br />And then I heard it was nominated for a bunch of Oscars. So probably not anime.<br /><br />So I took my niece. She had seen it but she was very happy to see it again. I think we were less than a minute into it when I whispered to her "I love this movie!"<br /><br />So, yeah, I was really drawn in by the very strong numbers in the beginning. I saw it again a few weeks later, and I eventually marked it as my favorite movie of 2016 on my IMDB Year-by-Year list.<br /><br />I'm not the biggest fan of the musical genre but I know a good one when I see it.Tonyhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/17921029597363212734noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3166297507174717122.post-60539211592567976402017-07-05T09:17:16.548-05:002017-07-05T09:17:16.548-05:00I can't argue with any of that.I can't argue with any of that.SJHoneywellhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13550007053995112090noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3166297507174717122.post-29049887521924408452017-07-05T08:31:40.140-05:002017-07-05T08:31:40.140-05:00I wouldn't have minded seeing a professional s...I wouldn't have minded seeing a professional singer in Ryan Gosling's role provided he could act as well as Gosling. But hell Jake Gyllenhaal, Chris Pine, Joseph Gordon Levitt and Bobby Magnusson to name a few can all actually sing at a professional level and the last three have shown themselves good dancers in other films or appearances, all are excellent actors and they are all more or less in the same age bracket as Gosling...so again I have to ask why? joel65913https://www.blogger.com/profile/14526657073681774683noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3166297507174717122.post-88334420047023082652017-07-05T07:39:30.303-05:002017-07-05T07:39:30.303-05:00I don't mind Stone's voice in general, alt...I don't mind Stone's voice in general, although she'll never make it as a singer. That's fine, whatever. I can live with it. But it seemed to me multiple times in the watching that Ryan Gosling really can't sing. In that respect, he's really mis-cast. I'd rather see someone who is more famous as a singer be given a chance to act at that point. SJHoneywellhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13550007053995112090noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3166297507174717122.post-28510018457992830022017-07-05T07:37:47.360-05:002017-07-05T07:37:47.360-05:00While it's true that neither Kelly nor Astaire...While it's true that neither Kelly nor Astaire would make it as a singer specifically, they could sing, and Gosling really can't. He sounded flat to me in every scene he sang in. Worse, he sounded tentative, like he wasn't really sure he should be singing.<br /><br />In terms of the look of the film, I agree. It is gorgeous to look at and I won't take that away from it.<br /><br />With being in the minority, I'm basing that more on Letterboxd than anything else. On that site, La La Land has nearly 50,000 4-5 star reviews and fewer than 5,000 reviews below 3 stars.SJHoneywellhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13550007053995112090noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3166297507174717122.post-2129340407754503732017-07-05T07:35:19.191-05:002017-07-05T07:35:19.191-05:00The same is true of Kelly. Kelly was always just a...The same is true of Kelly. Kelly was always just a talented dancer to me until I made the connection that he's also the smarmy, egotistical journalist in <i>Inherit the Wind</i>. <br /><br />There are actors who are immediately likable. Henry Fonda had that quality. So did Bing Crosby. Tom Hanks has it. It's why it can be so effective when an actor like that plays a true villain (Fonda in <i>Once Upon a Time in the West</i>, for instance). Even playing out of character--Bing Crosby in <i>The Country Girl</i>--is effective because we so naturally like the actor. Gosling, as good as he is, isn't that guy, and that's what <i>La La Land</i> needed.<br /><br />One of my favorite Fred Astaire movie moments was seeing him straight-up shank a dude in <i>Ghost Story</i>. When that happens, the reaction is less "Oh my God! Fred Astaire just stabbed a guy!" and more "You go, Fred!" Why? Because we like Fred Astaire characters as if we've been programmed to like them.SJHoneywellhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13550007053995112090noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3166297507174717122.post-75652532845773243162017-07-05T02:18:16.748-05:002017-07-05T02:18:16.748-05:00I loved this, but I do appreciate other's frus...I loved this, but I do appreciate other's frustrations with it. The singing and dancing is definitely not the strongest parts of the film (though Gene Kelly and Fred Astaire were not strong singers). I do love the actual score, though, so did purchase the soundtrack. <br /><br />I watched this before the hype (and may even have contributed that!), and loved how romantic and beautiful it was to look at; the planitarium scene is gorgeous.<br /><br />You may not be in such a small minority as you think; some people even wrote into newspaper in Australia saying how much they HATED it. I also know several people who really disliked it too.Julia Machttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09041411551162128922noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3166297507174717122.post-54562663277893440842017-07-04T20:49:13.232-05:002017-07-04T20:49:13.232-05:00You are right on the money with Fred Astaire's...You are right on the money with Fred Astaire's likability, because it wasn't until <a href="https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dcU0o7N2vig" rel="nofollow">Holiday Inn</a> that I realized he could act besides dance as he was a real cad who somehow made me root for Bing to end up with Marjorie Reynolds. This was the only film of Fred's that made me feel that way. And even with the massive age difference in "Daddy Long Legs," I still liked Fred's pursuit of Leslie Caron, while sometimes it seems that Gosling goes out of his way to make it hard for you to like him in many of his films and TV shows.John from Daejeonhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08431973044799010218noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3166297507174717122.post-88374700433676079612017-07-04T19:48:40.923-05:002017-07-04T19:48:40.923-05:00I like Emma Stone a great deal and as mediocre, un...I like Emma Stone a great deal and as mediocre, undistinguished voices go hers is better than Gosling so it would be fine for a one spot slot in a film, like Carey Mulligan's raw performance was in Shame, but to be the lead in a musical it's woeful. Marilyn Monroe wasn't a GREAT singer but her voice was distinctive and strong enough to work in musicals and to make you believe people would hire her for the jobs she supposedly had in her films. That's all I ask.joel65913https://www.blogger.com/profile/14526657073681774683noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3166297507174717122.post-47518102693161758932017-07-04T19:16:32.376-05:002017-07-04T19:16:32.376-05:00There are definitely some very good points here. T...There are definitely some very good points here. The direction and the production design are as good as you'll find, and the choreography is a part of that.<br /><br />But I can't imagine wanting to watch this again any time soon.SJHoneywellhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13550007053995112090noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3166297507174717122.post-90272683305731662422017-07-04T19:15:18.330-05:002017-07-04T19:15:18.330-05:00And here I thought I was a little harsh.
What I&...And here I thought I was a little harsh. <br /><br />What I'm happier about is the fact that I'm not alone in thinking that Gosling can't sing or dance. Stone is a little better in that respect, at least in terms of singing. She has a decent voice, but it's <i>so mousy</i> for so much of the movie. <br /><br />Your point on them "stretching" is well-taken as well. As someone watching the movie, it's impressive to know that Ryan Gosling practiced the piano several hours a day, six days every week for months to learn how to play for this role. And at the same time, a part of me doesn't care. All I want is for it to look good on the screen. <br /><br />And finally, yes--unlikable characters can work, but in a musical, that's a real problem. We <i>have</i> to like the characters to put up with the nonsense of the musical genre.SJHoneywellhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13550007053995112090noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3166297507174717122.post-49708686560050179162017-07-04T19:12:54.208-05:002017-07-04T19:12:54.208-05:00I don't have as much to say as those above. :...I don't have as much to say as those above. :-)<br /><br />I enjoyed it, but not as much as most. I too had some problems with the characters' likability, especially Gosling's. And the story was a little rote Hollywood. But I enjoyed a lot of the song and dance and I especially liked the opening traffic jam number. It's that kind of combination of artistic filming and singing and choreography that really makes me appreciate how talented human beings can be.Ipecachttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15157560182505626755noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3166297507174717122.post-57673962470504927972017-07-04T18:11:34.185-05:002017-07-04T18:11:34.185-05:00I’m afraid I’m going to go on a bit of a rant here...I’m afraid I’m going to go on a bit of a rant here. I’ve said before that I love musicals but I have to amend that. I love book musicals that may require some suspension of belief but make you feel for the characters, whether the subject matter is fluffy and light or serious and heavy. I also love dramas or comedies that aren’t musicals per se but feature musical numbers in a performative setting, ala Love Me or Leave Me. But most importantly I love musicals starring people who can SING! And if they can’t dub them with someone who can! <br /><br />I don’t expect every musical star to be Judy Garland, Gene Kelly or Doris Day, they are rare birds, but I want at least someone at the level of Susan Hayward in I’ll Cry Tomorrow-not a “professional” singer but someone who can carry a damn tune and has the projection to put a song across!<br /><br />The studios used to have more sense, Gordon MacRae and Bing Crosby could sing so they were cast appropriately in the genre…Cary Grant and Jimmy Stewart could not so aside from one studio mandated appearance for a just starting out Jimmy they were smart enough to stay away. Are Stone and Gosling talented? Absolutely but not in the vital aspect that this picture needs. They give good performances (not Oscar worthy but good) but there HAD to be performers with equivalent skill who could sing and dance! People will say “Oh but they’re stretching!” Let them take an aerobics class then!! Why should I as a paying customer be subjected to their (unsuccessful) voice lessons and for the most part glue-footed attempts at dance? <br /><br />To finish my original thought I hate musicals like Les Miserables where EVERYTHING is sung so it becomes a deadening slog to the finish line or movies like this one with persons of meager melodious talent playing characters who are mostly unlikable-fatal for a musical where you have to want to follow the protagonists through their flight of fancy. <br /><br />It’s a beautiful, eye filling package to be sure but it’s an empty one. The only really positive thing I can say for it aside from the look is that I didn’t hate it as I did Moonlight but only felt indifference.joel65913https://www.blogger.com/profile/14526657073681774683noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3166297507174717122.post-70268625195769534462017-07-04T17:13:09.952-05:002017-07-04T17:13:09.952-05:00I agree that the third act is the best part of the...I agree that the third act is the best part of the film, and along with the audition song, the epilogue is the best part of the entire film. I appreciate the nod to <i>An American in Paris</i> here as well as <i>The Umbrellas of Cherbourg</i>, just to name a few.<br /><br />I'll take a little issue with the idea that the Astaire/Rogers movies featured unlikable characters. There was a sweetness to those movies, a wide-eyed look at the world that <i>La La Land</i> didn't have. Additionally, those movies starred actors who were instantly likable in general. You see Fred Astaire, you like the character before he opens his mouth. Astaire had that quality to make even a rogue the guy you rooted for. Ryan Gosling is a damn fine actor, but he's not that guy, and neither in Emma Stone.<br /><br />By the way, in terms of age, my guess is that you and I are within a year or two of each other, Ace. I'm early Gen-X.SJHoneywellhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13550007053995112090noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3166297507174717122.post-83711836808652929462017-07-04T15:35:15.386-05:002017-07-04T15:35:15.386-05:00I will say, even with my just-above-lukewarm respo...I will say, even with my just-above-lukewarm response to the film, I was a big fan of the epilogue sequence. I don't know if it made the film worth it as a whole, but it was my favorite part of the whole thing, mostly thanks to my having seen most of the films Chazelle pretty much used as reference material and knowing how important it was to him to get that sequence done and done correctly. Sometimes having a possibly-unhealthy amount of cinema knowledge and experience can pay off. :)Adolytsihttps://www.blogger.com/profile/12266038228108057617noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3166297507174717122.post-19849092251676572982017-07-04T15:00:37.652-05:002017-07-04T15:00:37.652-05:00I loved La La Land, and I do think its one of the ...I loved La La Land, and I do think its one of the all-time best musicals (I have one leg in Boomerland and one leg with Gen X).<br /><br />I'll offer a couple of interesting points for discussion: many of the main characters in most of the classic Fred Astaire and Gene Kelly musicals were not all that likable either. Those musicals are (of course) now seen and assessed through the lens of nostalgia. I thought Chazelle did an absolutely remarkable job updating the musical for 2016.<br /><br />I do think La La Land was ruined for many people who saw it after it received the initial rush of effusive praise. I saw it in the theatre early in its run, and it was a fantastic experience. Once a film is very widely praised (as this one was) expectations go through the roof, and it's then difficult for any film to live up to a glowing reputation.<br /><br />Finally, the ending, that we will not ruin or talk about. It's here for those who want to check it out:<br /><br />https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8ZbXTzVTXv4<br /><br />Just to say brave, magical film-making, the "re-wind" sequence at the end is an all-time standout, AND THAT MUSIC accompanying the sequence is pure magic. The in-the-theatre experience is emotionally stunning.<br />aceblackblog.https://www.blogger.com/profile/08404695143187261837noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3166297507174717122.post-69496344270808494972017-07-04T14:32:44.228-05:002017-07-04T14:32:44.228-05:00Haha... I really liked Whiplash, too!Haha... I really liked Whiplash, too!Nickhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08092564511948736386noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3166297507174717122.post-86531397195728477602017-07-04T14:29:04.106-05:002017-07-04T14:29:04.106-05:00Right--exactly. I was expecting to at least be wow...Right--exactly. I was expecting to at least be wowed by the singing and dancing, and I just wasn't. <br /><br />As it happens, I didn't like <i>Whiplash</i> much, either. I'm starting to think it's something about Damien Chazelle or his movies or something. There's something I find very unpleasant about his characters--an inability to be flexible or to ease up, perhaps. <br /><br />I have yet to see both <i>Moonlight</i> and <i>Fences</i>. Right now, it would be hard for anything to top <i>Arrival</i> for me, but that's for very personal reasons.SJHoneywellhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13550007053995112090noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3166297507174717122.post-14779398106376687262017-07-04T13:54:53.274-05:002017-07-04T13:54:53.274-05:00None taken. The point is that I understand their c...None taken. The point is that I understand their conflicts. I think that as a rule, the Millennials are going through those struggles a little later than the previous generations. That gives a <i>sense</i> of "oh, grow up" from those previous generations that I think is unwarranted, but understandable. <br /><br />The point is that I get the struggles and conflicts. They aren't unique to the Millennials even if some of the specifics are.SJHoneywellhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13550007053995112090noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3166297507174717122.post-40595103416646954082017-07-04T13:09:11.608-05:002017-07-04T13:09:11.608-05:00Hey, no offense meant! I know every generation goe...Hey, no offense meant! I know every generation goes through similar and/or the same issues. I meant, really, the characters themselves and how they were behaving and reacting. It's been a while since I've seen it, so I can't give specifics. I just remember while watching it and immediately after how I felt connected to it and the characters' plights in a very unique way. Nickhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08092564511948736386noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3166297507174717122.post-90854077201082012232017-07-04T12:27:31.310-05:002017-07-04T12:27:31.310-05:00I went into this one expecting to sing its praises...I went into this one expecting to sing its praises along with everyone else and wonder how in the world it lost Best Picture in the most memorable Oscar gaff of all time; I came out of it only liking it and little more, and indeed if given the choice between rewatching this and Whiplash, I'll choose Whiplash almost every time. I haven't seen Moonlight yet, but for once I actually think I'm going to agree with the Academy's decision, from what I've heard of the latter film. Then again, I'd been hearing that this was the absolute most joyous, uplifting, and raucously entertaining film of 2016, and I ended up pretty much having the same opinion as you, both as a whole and on the individual aspects of the film, so who knows. But yeah, you're not entirely alone with where you ended up on this.Adolytsihttps://www.blogger.com/profile/12266038228108057617noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3166297507174717122.post-45108388797470611082017-07-04T11:56:27.315-05:002017-07-04T11:56:27.315-05:00The audition song is the highpoint of the film and...The audition song is the highpoint of the film and the third act is better than the first two. I'll grant you that.<br /><br />In terms of seeing layers, my guess is that it's less age and more focus. I didn't pay close attention to every detail in the film once I'd figured out that it was going to be a rough two hours. Depending on who you ask, neither, one, or both of my kids are millennials, so it's not like I'm completely ignorant of the problems the generation is experiencing.<br /><br />The other thing is this, and please don't take this the wrong way, but in a lot of ways, the Millennial generation is no different from every other generation, save that as a collective, they've gotten to the "you just don't understand us" part later than most. These characters have big dreams and big failures...unlike other generations? You think Gen-X or the Boomers didn't have big dreams and big failures? You think they weren't in many ways exactly like those of your generation?<br /><br />C'mon. The generations aren't radically different in all ways. There are a lot of similarities between generations. Yours may have more to deal with in some respects--there are massive economic shifts happening, for instance because a lot of the world's economy seems to be unsustainable--but don't kid yourself that somehow relationship problems or conflicting goals is unique to the Millennials.SJHoneywellhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13550007053995112090noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3166297507174717122.post-91031716067312843012017-07-04T11:39:48.123-05:002017-07-04T11:39:48.123-05:00Yeah, like I said, I can totally see anyone born b...Yeah, like I said, I can totally see anyone born before like... 1980, maybe?... not liking this movie. I actually agree with a lot of what you said. But the difference is, I understand these characters and their struggles. I understand their big dreams and big failures. It's definitely my generation portrayed in these characters. But I found a LOT of layers to this movie that it seems you didn't, but that's more an age thing, I think.<br /><br />As for the music, I liked most of it. I *love* Emma Stone's audition song around the start of the third act. That's the best moment in the entire movie. Hell, the entire third act was done so well. Though to be fair to your wife, I was unsure in the first 15 minutes, too. That opening number on the highway had me questioning the film immediately. It was a strange way to start, but I give it props for being done in a single shot. In fact, there were a LOT of numbers that were done in single shots, which is another reason I was so impressed with this film.Nickhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08092564511948736386noreply@blogger.com